OOC Chat

Hey gang, we're beyond character creation now, so I am starting up just a "normal" ooc chat thread.

This thread is for whatever idle chatter we have as players; could be speculative rules questions (rules questions relevant to active gameplay, I might prefer to resolve in the in character thread in which the rule is immediately relevant), or IRL life stuff - including plz let is know of any foreseeable, prolonged posting absences here - or other meta WoD or RPG stuff, etc.

Btw, regarding umbral travel related metaplot. Will we steering closer to M2 - travel is dangerous but pretty common, or will we going with the Revised Avatar Storms and the like, where traveling the Umbra is reeealy risky and potentially deadly? I guess same question applies to the overall tone - more hopeful Mage 2e or depressed Revised, where the war is over and nobody won? I kinda leaned into horror in the prelude, but if we're going into for a more lighter tone, i can even it out.

Also, are we still doing the whole spy thriller thing? Or just wing a more general type Mage chronicle and see where it takes us? I did fine the spy idea intriguing, but i'm not married to it, in case you had other ideas.

No more spy thriller.

I don't have a good enough grasp on how to portray or carry out the Reality War stuff, and don't think I can pull off that kind of high conflict plot.

We'll be dwelling more in the discovery and explorative space.

After we get through character Awakenings and things, I have a couple ideas for situations that will open us up to actual gameplay/dice rolling and stakes. But once those are over? I think we'll be done here, unless someone else wants to take over at that point.

Sorry, missed some posts this week, irl swallowed me whole. Will try to catch up tomorrow/on monday, finish with the prologues.

I have worked on typing up the backstory four times now over the past week or so, and every time I have I either get called away for a while or fall asleep, and my phone reloads so I lose what I had.

I'm going to type it in Notes then transfer it over. (Shit always has to be more difficult than needed, I swear.)

Yea that is standard procedure for me now, with long posts.

I lost too many hours on too many posts, retyping things because I drove into the area of a new tower, or switched wifis or battery dropped too low (and my saver settings classes all "non essential") or whatever.

If I don't have a post fully turned in my mind and the time to type it? I'm putting it in Notes and copy pasta

I've checked a few other games and it seems we are not the only concerned party regarding Ma's absence. Dude's in a lot of games and it seems like there haven't been any notice beforehand. I just hope everything is good and it's nothing serious.

So I think for the current scene we can maybe readjust it a little and introduce me and Theha's Dominic first and then have Ma's James be introduced later during the meeting after he's back.

Thanks for doing that leg work. That is pretty uncharacteristic for Ma, and indeed I hope all is well too.

As for the current/intro scene... I mean this whole scene and premise hinges on bringing Traditions and Techno together. So in order to keep things moving forward meaningfully, and without recon, I think at this time I'd prefer we just "background" Ma for now?

Their character is there, but since the player is not, the character is treated as an inconsequential NPC for now. Meaning we just don't have the benefit as players of his roleplay. James will be assumed to be interacting in small but insignificant ways as a low ranking Techno would, but we don't "zoom in" on it, or describe it., nor even zoom in on any interactions that would happen with him (like introductions, tho again it can be assumed to have happened, as it would). And instead focus on you two and the two "major" NPCs.

Then whenever Ma is able to return, his character knows everything that your characters know (the character was there), and he can provide us any intro/description/insights then, and just step more fully into the skin of James and have him emerge from the background into the spotlight in line and in the same "place" (narratively speaking) as you two, wherever we are at in play.

This is how I prefer to handle brief absences at irl games, and I would prefer it here too.

I mean, I don't see this scene lasting a particularly long time tho, and soon we'll be in the thick of it.

This could become a bigger hang up quite rapidly...

If it does, at that time we will retcon, and just say it's only you two and has always been only you two. And because that will have been the way it was played, it should be a pretty smooth retcon.

Sounds good to me. Ready to proceed. Hopefully it's not nothing serious with Ma and we're all worrying over nothing.

RE: the Manipulation+Alertness roll, and the stated goal(s) of the roll:So, I think it's important that we start off trying to be on the same page about the mechanics/rolls we're making.

And so, I feel like I need to bring up that I don't necessarily see Manipulation as an appropriate Attribute to pair with Alertness, and also that Alertness doesn't necessarily match up with what you're saying you want to achieve...

Alertness - for noticing actions or physical things that are hidden

Awareness - "6th sense"-stuff, for noticing the supernatural

Empathy - for noticing subtlties in how people are reacting or behaving, picking up on motives

Subterfuge - for noticing active deception attempts made against you

Sound correct?/Make sense?

And I feel like you're conflating two or maybe even three separate things into one check:
1. he wants to follow what's going on
2. wants to play it cool

And 3, he also maybe feels out of place, and like he has to play a part or manipulate people here into believing he belongs here?

RE: 1. if you're rolling the dice to follow what's going on, this sounds like Empathy to me. Success will reveal subtle social dynamics that you as a player don't pick up on and/or motives behind what is being said. If you want to be in tune with the other people, their motives and behavior, it's Empathy. Probably pairs with Wits, though could be Perception if you're focusing on body language. Or you could roll Subterfuge if you think you're actively being deceived, but no one has even really said anything to you yet. And/or/but, if you think someone is hiding... something material... a weapon, movements, whatever? Then that's Alertness. But never really is any of that going to be with Manipulation, which is used when you're acting to try to manipulate or deceive someone yourself, not when sensing or detecting manipulation.

RE: 2, playing it cool sounds like it could be Etiquette to me (paired with Wits? or Charisma?) - playing the part ,behaving appropriately in this situation, convincing others you belong. Or, conceivably... basically a Willpower roll - resisting fear/"brute force" composure/preventing yourself from panic. I don't like the latter here, because that should more be in response to an effect that I'm invoking upon you. So I go back to the former.

So...

Yea, this is a good microcosm for you guys to understand my personal understanding and implementation of the use of the Attributes and Abilities in 20th... There are defined boundaries to what Attribute and what Ability should be paired and when/in what situation.

Does this seem consistent with your own understandings, or at least does it sound fair?

Or do we need to talk about differences in understandings of mechanics before we get too deep?

Perception+Awareness to feel out any magics around or Perception+Alertness to notice it's physical manifestations - whether it is sigils painted on the wall or the ripples in the air caused by the active spells.
If he is trying to behave appropriately to the situation at hand - Wits+Etiquette

If he is nervous and trying to appear like he is not/trying to mask his emotional response - Manipulation+Subterfuge

---

Just my two cents. Agree with the rest.

Completely agree that Manipulation+Alertness is an unusual pairing; the thinking was he's trying to read the rules and patterns of behaviour inherent in the ceremonial; hence, literally trying to pick up on the currents of, not simply current behaviour of those in the room, but a rough feel for the nature and structure of the meeting, and so a sense of any distinction between routine and exceptional subject matter. Hence, sensing by mundane means the factors impacting behaviour, and notable points in the flow of the meeting; so, that's why Manipulation +Alertness. (My first thought was Perception and Manipulation until I remembered that's two attributes!)
The kind of things I was hoping he might pick up on, if applicable;
- The nature of the truce or understanding between the Traditions and the Technocracy - any references to rules or protocols?
- What if any other matters come up, and whether those are routine or not?
- Suggestions as to current tensions w.r.t. the above?
With hindsight and deconstruction, I can see that some of that would fall under Empathy, and some of the rest might have been addressed by prior research IC; my bad for missing that opportunity.
Basically, I was trying to work out how the character might attempt to apply his abilities in the situation at hand.

No attempt to sense or use magick was intended; hence no mention of Awareness.

Quite reasonable that Dominic's own demeanour should be a separate roll if warranted. To try and be more specific, he is trying not to give anything away, rather than actively fit in. I would suggest Manipulation and Subterfuge is a reasonable combination for this, if there is any need to roll.

Am I right in assuming that I should in future explain my goals and agree stats to use before rolling? I'm used to other games where pre-emptive rolling to maintain momentum is generally a plus; but those are simpler, less social systems.

So I gave you a bunch of information RE: the nature of the truce in the first post. Here's a copy paste of that information: In summary: it's a tense truce.

That's the important part right?

And sure. There are rules and protocols. But... they're not important are they? Particularly because you guys are just gonna follow them, aren't you? You have to for the group to come together, right?

All of this is just a narrative artifice so that we can bring the group together in a plausible fashion, right? None of this scene really matters, beyond that.

It's a tense truce.

There are rules and protocols.

You follow the rules and protocols.

Let's move on to a place on the narrative where there is more interesting information and gameplay to zoom in on.

I'm not hiding anything from you guys in this scene or interaction. I'm just "bringing the group together". And introducing the first "adventure".

So again, just a bit of insight into my ST style there.
And I don't think there is a roll needed to "not give anything away". You don't really have anything to give away yet, and feeling/seeming out of place or out of your depth is rather inconsequential (if for no other reason than because it is assumed by the senior members) at this time :P

As for explaining your goals for future rolls...

I mean, I don't think that should be necessary most of the time?

However I say that based on an assumption that we all understand the system to work/rolls to be formed roughly the same. And so this has made me question my assumption in that regard.

How about:

If you're following one of the many pre-defined actions in the book that has a "RAW" roll defined for it, you don't need to add context.

However, if you're just making up your own roll, let's give the context you think is necessary, to understand why you put the roll together as you did.

Sounds good. Sorry to vex you!

I’m not sure what’s happened, but my character sheet suddenly seems blank.
Everything but the avatar, gone. Even the name was blank.
Thankfully, I have screenshots. It should take me a good half hour to recreate him later tomorrow as I have a copy of Majunior’s template in place to work from.

Keep backups, people!

Oh no! I'm sorry that happened, that sucks

Check the staging version of the site, it might have the sheet saved. I remember that problem mention, I'll try to locate that thread later today. It mention the problem, how to avoid and where to try and restore the sheet (staging).

Here's the thread about it: https://gamersplane.com/forums/thread/37763/

And the link to staging: https://staging.gamersplane.com

My vote is to move on to the next scene. Doesn't seem much left to do in this one. The guys can chat, plan, get to know each other, etc in the next. If we move on, should we continue with that in the chapter one thread or will you make a new one?

I think the bigger question is what to do with MJ's James. Do you want to NPC him for a bit? Phase him out? Or do a soft tag along, where he is with us, just not the most talkative or active type and follows our lead?

John's plan for the most part would be "go and check it out, maybe do some research on the way".

I'm pretty concerned about MaJ. Don't know if anyone has heard anything but I've gamed with him before and never seen anything like this disappearance... As for his character, I'd like to have him tag along still. There, but not there.

Basically until that's just not tenable anymore (i.e. up until it just makes no sense that he's not doing anything/up until we're, like, there on-site and stuff's happening).

Which... is coming quick, frankly, but maybe not quite here yet.

And we'll continue the narrative in the same thread, whether we remain in this scene for a bit more, or if we move away to another location and time.

Thank you for taking the trouble; accessing the old version of the character has enabled me to recreate him much more easily.

@ThetaSigma So does Dom wants to ask the Technocrat bosses for access to law enforcement data or MJ' James, cause I thought we sorta leaving him hanging for now, which is I didn't include him in the convo much and tried to shift it a bit away from relaying on the Syndicate.

Alternative mundane option can be stopping by the police station, I guess. Or if em @emsquared can NPC James a bit, maybe make a roll to get the info or something? What's our approach here?

Hi guys. I’m really excited to join the group. My current vague concept is a Man in Black clone who defected from the Technocracy because he felt it no longer stood for what it should.

Hey, there, welcome. Technocracy is fine, since the "truce" was sort of backed into the premise by the original ST, but how should we handle defectors? Would your guy be a Tradition (aligned) mage now? I feel like the Technocrats might have something to say about that..

Please give the first post in the IC thread a read, that is where I describe the premise of how/why a Techno might be working with two Traditions Mages.

If you find that workable, we will just drop your PC into Ma's character's shoes.

If you don't like the premise, then... we'll just retcon in your former-Techno. The meeting didn't happen and you were all just sent to do the things by the Traditions.

Maybe the working-relationship is still there maybe not? If it comes up, we'll decide then. If it doesn't come up then it doesn't matter, and you'll just be there still.

The defector thing was just to kind of explain why he wasn’t trying to kill you all. I’ll retcon that

Right.

Doing a mixed Faction chronicle would not have been my first choice as an ST.

But the ST who dropped out allowed it and so I just ran with it when I took over, cuz the characters were made by that point and everyone was fine with it, conceptually.

I think there can be some interesting/fun interactions there for everyone to play with, as is. Differences in paradigm and all that can just be kind of fun to poke at.

But so, if you need to be a "former" for it to work in your brain. Ok.

And if you can just roll with the premise we've already set up. Ok too.

Great to have another prospective player. Just let us know which approach you want to go with. There is a precedent for renegade MiBs, and I don’t mean the movie versions.

I think maybe he’s kind of operating semi-independently. Like he’s still part of the technocracy, and considers himself a technocrat. But maybe he’s either been given a lot of leeway for some reason or his boss isn’t around for some reason

The current setup is unusual, at least in my experience, as the Technocracy and Traditions have a relative detente in this setting. If anything, it seems your character would normally be expected to uphold that, so you needn’t worry overmuch about finding excuses not to kill us reality deviants!

Okay! Right now my current plan for his backstory is he grew up in foster care/ divorced parents and kind of learned to be "invisible" (metaphorically) and became a conspiracy theory nerd. He started posting wild crap conspiracy theories online, and one of his was a bit to close to the truth (he had no idea) so the NWO sent someone to deal with him.

Luckily for Grover, the agent who found him had better things to do than kill teenagers and recruited him instead

Also, I would love a quick rundown of the plot and anything I would know. I plan to have my guy finished in like, two days? More if I get to focused on the cool merits and flaws.

I thought he was a clone..? Or did you mean it figuratively, as in "character like men in black"? It should also be noted that Technocratic agents undergo quite a bit of training and conditioning before being allowed to work in the field. I assume that you meant that your guy was picked up as teen, recruited, trained and now is ready to be released in the field as a young adult, correct?
You can check out the IC (In Character) thread for the plot, it's pretty short, only 2 pages long so far. tl;dr is that Technocrats and Traditions work together in the San Antonio, Texas, US. You've been summoned to a regularly scheduled meeting between the bosses of 2 factions and along with 2 other newbies tasked with investigating a suspicious place, where strange disappearances have taken place and an unknown Resonance have been detected.

We are currently figuring out our plan of action in-character.

I retconned the clone thing because I wanted to give him friends and family and stuff. That is exactly what I meant. He was trained until his mid twenties and has been doing field stuff form maybe three years.

The in character thread is not that long yet.

Please read it.

Will do!

I’m going to be away from home for most of the coming week, and today is packing day, so I’m already pretty busy. I will try to keep tabs on what’s happening but my time to post is going to be limited at best; I’m unsure what WiFi provision will be like. @emsquared, feel free to make obvious rolls for Dominic if it’ll keep things moving and I haven’t responded in a reasonable time.

Thanks for the heads up!

@TechnocratSloth15 How's the character creation going? Need any help?

I will admit I'm a little confused

Mostly with merits and bonus points

Let's talk about it then.

What's confusing you?

You can spend the Freebies on these things at these rates:

It’s usual to roughly balance merits and flaws in cost; seven points of flaws is a hard limit, but any excess of merits bought above flaws has to be paid from freebie points.
There is more than a slight tendency (for me anyway!) to suffer from candy-store syndrome with merits, and then have to whittle down the wish list to those most important to the concept that you can afford.
Edit: Dominic’s shortlist of merits and flaws is still there at the bottom of his character sheet, so if you’re interested you can see what I had to discard…

On another note, Merits and Flaws are entirely optional. Merits can be purchased with Freebie points, while taking a Flaws adds Freebie points that you can spend on other things.

@TechnocratSloth15 please engage me/us over your questions so we can get you a character made.

The game is in flight, we (try to) post every day and the group would benefit from having you in character sooner rather than later.

Okay. I’ve got the skills all picked out
It’s arete and merits i’m having trouble with. Sorry I was gone. I had a trip

I have 15 bonus points, right?

15 freebie points, which you can spend as per the chart @emsquared posted a little above.

@TechnocratSloth15 how's it going with character creation?

Getting close? Have any questions ?

Hey guys. I’m really sorry, but IRL shit came up out of nowhere, and I have too cancel. I am so sorry

It happens, don't worry. Maybe next time.

No surprise there.

Okeydoke! Onward and upward!

Sorry to hear that, @TechnocratSloth15. Best of luck with your RL!

Forward!

Just a heads up team, I have 2 kids home sick today and won't be able to post. Will try to catch up tomorrow, but may then be extra busy at work catching up with that, so...

Point is, gonna have a bit of an lull here. Stick with me!

No worries, hope the little ones get well soon!

All sympathy here; I only have one son, but my wife’s health is poor, so the interruptions come frequently. Guess why I choose an intermittent hobby like PbF :-)

I'm going to be in the hospital for up to 30th. Hopefully not that long though. Will try to post as much as I can, but that will mostly depend on if the internet behaves..

Thanks for the heads up reversia! Take care, hope all is well soon.

Best of luck, @reversia!

Good news: I'm back for the weekend, then gotta go back on Monday, though hopefully only for 2-3 days, depending on tests and such. So shouldn't be gone long.

Hey gang, between my absences from work last week (and having to play catch up now), and then the American holiday occurring this week (for which I'm traveling), I will probably not be posting much until Dec. 2 or so.

Apologies, but we'll see you all then.

Safe travels!

Hey, I assume we are taking a bit of break due to holidays, right?

Also, I was curious. @ThetaSigma It has been a while since char-gen, but I thought Dominic was working his magic primarily through sound/music, sorta like terrestrial Macross 7 dude. But then there was mention of the nanobots and now I'm a bit confused. And curious. Does he control them with sound or are they automatic? How do they fit in with the musical/audial theme?

Yea, we had another set of sickness blow through the house and it's messed with my posting sorry. Going to try to get a post in today.

No, that's quite alright, just wanted to make sure. Hope everyone gets well soon!